unborn 2017-03-05 10:47:32
oh wow.. I think stretch is really really great, cannot wait for release
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:52:17
unborn: then don't wait. get involved!
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:52:22
:)
unborn 2017-03-05 10:52:48
Klaus_Dieter: just testing in virtualmin
unborn 2017-03-05 10:52:56
re* virtualbox
unborn 2017-03-05 10:52:57
;D
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:53:58
I never quite understood the concept of those install roles. I am awayre that the installer-guys have to come up with something new every now and then but frankly a minimal set really is all that is needed. afterwards apt-get install $THE_DESKTOP_I_LIKE fixes the rest if indeed a desktop is needed
nkuttler 2017-03-05 10:54:29
roles? tasks?
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:54:34
nkuttler: exactly.
missmbob 2017-03-05 10:54:48
most people do that. it's not done for you. it's for newbies and to make things easier for them
nkuttler 2017-03-05 10:54:50
noob friendly
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:56:03
well.. imo this is one of the things were a supposedly newbie-friendly makes things more difficult... no I have to understand the concept of roles and check what packages selection is in each of them.. and I have to wonder whether timing parameters and memory parameters are actually adapted as well...
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:56:27
ie udp buffers might increase, maybe the default config of sshd is different in a server role too....
missmbob 2017-03-05 10:56:35
nothing newbiews would even know to think of
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:56:40
I know
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:56:50
but everyone else suddenly has to think of
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:56:59
let me repharse that
missmbob 2017-03-05 10:57:05
so dont make it more complicated for them. accept it. we can read texts and know to do so
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:57:26
missmbob: yes that is nothing newbies would thinkg of but it forces everyone else to put thought into now that the concept of roles has been introduced.
nkuttler 2017-03-05 10:57:47
yet i never think about tasks
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:57:49
I do accept it. I just don'T like it :)
missmbob 2017-03-05 10:57:54
i dont care about everyone else. they'll just skip it and lose maybe 1.5 seconds
missmbob 2017-03-05 10:58:03
okay :)
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 10:59:49
missmbob: but maybe in that regard I am more in the bsd camp.... have some documentation that tells what setting is to be set, what it does and why it is needed, the last part being the most important.
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:00:23
still I have swithed back from bsd even with using zfs and all..... because... well... debian is just better. :)
abs 2017-03-05 11:05:08
is it possible to change journald logs output directory?
abs 2017-03-05 11:05:24
I want to have the logs in a different partition
abs 2017-03-05 11:05:46
but can't find such an option in the manpage or the net
artificialamateu 2017-03-05 11:09:51
h
abs 2017-03-05 11:10:06
h?
OerHeks 2017-03-05 11:10:47
storage= ... https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/journald.conf.html
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:13:34
abs: you could mount your partition to /var/log
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:14:03
abs: having logs somewhere else does not comply with "man hier"
abs 2017-03-05 11:15:33
hmm how come, I think it's good practice on a server
tw 2017-03-05 11:16:14
abs: the short version is systemd is not configurable, but you can adjust the rest of the systems to put things where it expects.
abs 2017-03-05 11:16:52
yeah I could ln -s /var/log/journal to somewhere else
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:17:00
abs: it is horrible to put logfiles all over the place for anyone having to log on to the server and find an issue quickly.
tw 2017-03-05 11:17:19
Klaus_Dieter: doesn't matter if they have to use journalctl anyway.
abs 2017-03-05 11:17:30
I will put ALL logs smewhere else
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:17:42
abs: I am aware that some RoR-applications and nodejs and generally apps from the fancy-folk do this. still it is bad. the standard is there for a reason.
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:17:49
java does this too.
abs 2017-03-05 11:18:38
I think keeping the OS clean and isolated to it's own partition is good practice for a server
abs 2017-03-05 11:18:47
also makes for easier backups
th_ 2017-03-05 11:19:28
was debian 2.2 really a potato?
tw 2017-03-05 11:19:29
that's why you put /var on its own partition.
abs 2017-03-05 11:19:39
th_ lol
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:19:46
that is wrong on multiple levels. "the os" already may use multiple partitions /boot is adviasable and /var is adviasble to be separate as well
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:20:16
/home is advisable as well to have on a different partition
bazhang 2017-03-05 11:20:23
Klaus_Dieter, not for ages
missmbob 2017-03-05 11:20:29
no one said this was a good idea :P
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:20:32
am I that old? :)
abs 2017-03-05 11:20:48
Klaus_Dieter: you sir are a dinosaur
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:20:58
crap.
abs 2017-03-05 11:21:01
lol
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:22:07
well, still I advise to use the layout written down in "man hier" because that means that new admin folk will know their way around the file system without having to poke in horrible application documentation
missmbob 2017-03-05 11:22:21
yeah. i'd fire you otherwise
abs 2017-03-05 11:22:58
missmbob: you can't fire me you fool, I'm the boss! I fire YOU!
missmbob 2017-03-05 11:23:10
damnit! :(
abs 2017-03-05 11:23:21
yep you sir are so fired
Klaus_Dieter 2017-03-05 11:23:49
of course you could interpret that as a teaser for the application folk to make an effort and improve documentation... well it still sucks coming into a critical incident and not even knowing where the f**k the app-team chose to place their logs.
abs 2017-03-05 11:23:50
you're ALL fired
abs 2017-03-05 11:25:00
Klaus_Dieter: it can be moved and still be clear
abs 2017-03-05 11:25:54
it's not like Linux has the most clean FS structure ever made... by far imho
